[ for a very important date ]

[winterlive]

so i have a question for you lot.

most of my morning has been spent reading [ this ] (which sprung from [ this ]) and the associated links in comments. as a result, i now have a question for you all.

[Poll #950389]

*to clarify: the PEOPLE will still exist to either ghost hunt or act, whatever. just they will no longer be fcuking. vote for the one you want to keep.

Comments

[estrella30.livejournal.com]

THIS IS HARD, DANNY.

though, lemme just put a disclaimer on my answer that I picked j2 because I know that I, personally, write more j2, and read more j2 than wincest. that's not to say that I dont read or write wincest, because I do both, but I will click into a j2 fic quicker than a wincest fic if given both at the same time.

also, I can't possibly think of a stupider fucking argument that people only write wincest because they dont want to write j2. it's just simply ridiculous. jared and jensen are SO FAR from sam and dean, and if you choose to basically *make up* shit about two, hot, semi-outgoing actors who have NO ANGST that we can see, instead of the two dark, demon hunting characters that deal with life and death things on a semi-normal basis, uhm, one might just be easier for someone to write than the other. it's not that they're REPRESSED into writing it, for god's sake.

*koff*

uhm. sorry! but yeah. the whole "only writing wincest because they dont want to write j2" thing bugs me.

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

personally, i wind up reading more sam/dean than j2. but i write WAAAAAY more j2 than sam/dean. hee, maybe I'M repressed. :D

i picked j2 because i tend to enjoy way more in the way of gen sam & dean than i do gen jared & jensen. i mean, yeah, boys screwing around on set is hilarious and all, but if i am FORCED to pick one pair that can never screw again, it's gonna be sam & dean, if only because i like them just fine when they're not. like. *makes hands*

also i think jared/jensen enjoys it more than sam/dean. so ANGSTY, the brothers, god, i mean. i like some angst now and then, but. AIGH. SO MUCH STABBING.

ps hi nan!!1!

[snarkyducky.livejournal.com]

that's like asking me if i wanna disappear Pizza or Panda cubs from the face of the earth... :X man, the thought is so depressing i think i'd just rather off myself..

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

hee. oh presh, i'm sorry. c'mere, i hug. <3

[teaspoon.livejournal.com]

i can't do it, man. there was a time when i would have picked the former, no question, and another time when i would have picked the latter, but as of now, even though i haven't read stuff for either pairing in quite a while, it's a dead tie, mostly because they are such different animals to me.

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

i really do tend to agree. i haf post my reasons above, to nan, but i wound up picking j2 to continue the sexxx, and sam & dean to roam the world anew and innocent. :D

[xmasbabee.livejournal.com]

I'll read both, and I don't care either way. The way I justify the possible Wincest on the show is, I'm and only child plus I know it's fiction. And the whole "dire circomstaces/closer then brothers" always holds up, I think.

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

man, i'm totally on board the sam/dean train. it's just, like. show me sam & dean genfic, and then jared & jensen genfic, and i'd rather read the sam & dean. so. j/j it is!

[valancymay.livejournal.com]

How about Alec/Dean? I choose (dark angel) Alec/(gilmore) Dean.

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

if you find some of that on the internet, you link me to it. forthwith.

...man. i might even write that if i had any characterization for gilmore dean at all.

you're a genius.

[luminosity]

Raping canon? WTF?

[gets out the popcorn]

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

hee. i know. BUT THE POLL, LUM.

[balefully.livejournal.com]

sdfuohidfhfughj. I just INJURED MYSELF trying to make a decision. But like, with Sam and Dean, I feel like I NEED the fic more. With Jared and Jensen, we don't know anything about their "canon" for real, what their personalities are really like, who they really hang out with, ANYTHING. So I can pretend whatever I like. With Sam and Dean, we know for a fact they're not sexxin' it up on the show, so I depend on fic to get my fix.

I think? GOD I don't know. D: What a depressing question.

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

I'M SORRY omg.

but it was important, you understand. *pet pet pet*

and just think, now there is a whole wide world of BOTH for you to dive back into. :D

[apetslife.livejournal.com]

I LOVE Jensen and Jared. But I love Sam and Dean just a LITTLE bit more. *grin*

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

how come! enquiring minds want to know! *takes notes*

[ladycat777.livejournal.com]

Now I'm confused. Are we voting for which one we could *lose* or the one we'd want to *keep*? Because keeping Sam/Dean. Angst, character issues, and the occasional mythical event. Me = happy.

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

then you vote sam/dean. it is for keepsies!

*marks you down in several boxes*

[azewewish.livejournal.com]

Okay, really, I can't believe that post even MADE it to fandom_wank, let alone that you're perpetrating it by making a poll. Seriously, Danny, it's MY opinion. Which isn't a new one, btw, and I'm sorry if people don't like it, but I stated it in MY journal.

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

frankly, i'm a little surprised it made f_w myself. it didn't raise a big kerfuffle or anything. and i'm sure you know i don't agree with your opinion, being a reader/writer/reccer of sam/dean myself.

but it did raise an interesting point for me - gun to your head, which one do you pick? - and so i thought i'd do a poll about it. i chose one side myself, which (again, interestingly to me) was j2, which you'd predicted would be the case.

i'm not looking to perpetuate wank. i'm just curious. i don't think the poll was biased. i don't think i stated a preference, aside from voting myself. it just got me to thinking - which is, i assume, why you posted your thoughts to begin with, right?

[sevenfists.livejournal.com]

Hey, would you mind not linking to my post? I really don't need more of this foolishness in my inbox. Thanks!

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

sure, no problem.

[killabeez.livejournal.com]

Interesting question. I'm really attracted to the idea of J2, which in itself is a surprising and a first for me, but I don't find that I can actually (or want to actually) read it very often. It's a line I find it hard to cross, inventing stuff about real people. I have a whole different set of hangups about Sam/Dean, much more emotionally thorny and troubling to me, but at the same time, it's entirely fiction, so I find a freedom there to work them out that I don't feel where actual people who might, you know, read it, are involved. Then there's the fact that I feel like I know Sam and Dean, whereas I don't know J2 at all, so I'm much more involved in their "lives," emotionally.

I'm fascinated (though not really surprised) to see the results of your poll thus far.

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

i know, right! frankly, i'm pretty surprised. i thought for sure there would be a big bias toward one side or the other, and yet.

it really IS an interesting question, like. it makes the thoughts for thinking. some of the most interesting responses are in comments, as far as they why people chose who they did. thank you for responding, like. :)

[redbrickrose.livejournal.com]

I said J2, mainly because I'll take Jared/Jensen anyway I can get it, but I am so, so picky about Wincest that only about one out of every ten stories really works for me. (That doesn't mean I don't read it. It just means I don't buy it). I like the Winchesters just fine (and sometimes better) in genfic. I don't have so much intersted in j2 genfic.

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

that's EXACTLY why i picked j2.

except where i'm pickier about j2 than i am about sam/dean. but HARDLY THE POINT because i can't read j2 right now anyway as i am writing a massive j2 novel. so.

sam & dean can gen around all they like is the point. i'm totally in. and frankly, i'm kind of in for j2 genfic as well, but just less so than for sam/dean. :D

[trinity_clare]

Did I just break the tie (again)? O.o

I picked J2. I have no idea what's wrong with me. Except that for Sam and Dean, it's like the best and deepest and awesomest part of their relationship isn't the sex. It's everything else - which is canon, btw, and have I mentioned how much I love our show? So really I can take gen or whatever brand of slashy subtexty thing we've got in canon now and live with that.

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

DUDE YES EXACTLY. YAYE. i loff sam & dean and i love them whether they are slashed or ampersanded.

and it's not that i haven't, like WRITTEN gen j2, because i have. but, gun to my head, it's sam & dean and j/j.

[cereta.livejournal.com]

Can I totally not care either way, as I don't read either? ;)

Which, you know, no reason for me to announce, I suppose, except to say that here's me, reading neither, feeling totally unoppressed by fandom. I sometimes feel a twinge of sympathy for gen fans of my fandoms past when I back out of commentary, or read something about how obvious something I didn't see was, but man: that's fandom, and having so totally been on the other side of that equation, I don't see the point in complaining about it, you know?

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

you can TOTALLY not care all over the place. :D

you're a rock star, as always. <3

[beatperfume.livejournal.com]

Aw, and here I thought that people who wrote J2 were just too chicken to write incest. *snerk*

On a less sarcastic note, I chose Sam/Dean. I love J2, it's fun and wonderful, but it doesn't hit me in the gut like Sam/Dean does. After I read a good J2 story, I'm happy, I'm in a good mood, and as much as I loved it, I will have moved on in half an hour. A good Sam/Dean story will be on my mind for DAYS. I will think about it while I'm at work, I will think about it before I go to sleep. It will make my fingertips tingle and my legs jittery.

Maybe because I really do love the supernatural aspect so much, or maybe because Sam and Dean are SO fucked up I can't help but love them more. Of course, it's very possible that it's because I know a hell of a lot more about Sam and Dean than I do about Jared and Jensen.

Bottom line being, Sam/Dean = <3

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

OOOH, that is a brand new reason!! *makes notes* thank you!

hmm. sam = <3. dean = <3. sam/dean = <6? :D

[winterweathered.livejournal.com]

It took me way too long to decide.

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

don't feel bad, man, clearly bunches of people are having SERIOUS CONSIDERATIONS. <333

why did you choose the way you did?

[luvxander.livejournal.com]

But...we have to choose? Why can't we just have Sam/Jensen/Dean/Jared? Choosing should be abolished, and when I'm elected president, it shall be the first second third thing on my to-do list. Right behind death to all bush's and the gay marriage right. Also, I'm thinking of revoking the str8 people's right to marriage for a few years, see how they like it.

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

HEY. BEHAVE YOURSELF.

1. there will be no beheadings.
2. you make HATE CRIMES punishable by marriage revocation. SOME straight people like you just fine, punk.

[lavenderfrost.livejournal.com]

I'd have to go with Sam/Dean. Much as I love the J2, I can take it or leave it. I like other pairings too, mind you, but having to go without Wincest altogether is just...wrong.

Also? After reading F_W, I'm totally jonesing for Metallicar/DeLorean fic OMG.

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

HEE HEE HEE. he's her secret lover!!

[babyofthegroup.livejournal.com]

Well, you know my answer. No contest, really -- I like domesticity and happy endings. Which of the two above has that potential? Only one, as far as I can see.

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

yeah. yeah.

...yeah.

*clutch*

[kattyerin.livejournal.com]

i flipped a coin. :D

ok, not really. but it's so hard to choose. jared and jensen dress more to my liking? i would choose all the groping jared and jensen do, but really, we get plenty of sam/dean touchy feely.

i'm going to go with i think alot of the jared/jensen fic is lighter. with more smiling? maybe.

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

hee. yeah, sam/dean writers do have something of a tendency to pile on the angst. and, hm. not so much, me.

[wingedvictory.livejournal.com]

This is HARD. Like petrified wood hard. Titanium diamond-plated platinum something or othery hard.

However.

In an effort to break the stalemate, I choose Sam/Dean because although I like the J^2 name better than Wincest, there's less chance of getting the names mixed up in my head and saying to myself, "Wait, stop, Jared's fucking his own ass? Nooo, JENSEN is. Ok." Yes no?

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

hee. i actually wrinkle my nose a little at the word "wincest" now. maybe i'm just a completist: WINGCEST OR NOTHIN!

[onefishjyuufish.livejournal.com]

I dunno, the Sam/Dean sex is usually awesome (and sometimes crack-filled), but it's also how the supernatural actually features in there somewhere, usually, or at least is implicit in the universe it takes place in. I don't get that with J2, though I suppose you could write it that way... But then I'd be reading J2 in Sam and Dean's world and then I get confused.

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

okay, that makes sense to me! thanks for answering, sugar doll. :)

[traveller.livejournal.com]

do i stuff the ballot box, or let the people decide on their own? decisions, decisions.

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

you can only vote once, miss nixon!! <333

[too-rational.livejournal.com]

*peeks in* Ok, I feel oh-so-totally out of place as neither a wincester or a rps-er (but who read some examples of both 'cause I'm a bitch for a good fic no matter how/when/why/with-what-kinks is it written :D) but -- I chose J² only because they're not actual brothers and (their straightness -- in my humble opinion -- aside) they can get together in a healthy, happy-end-y kind of way. 'Cause I'm also a sucker for happy ends and in-character behavior (the last one applicable, obviously, only to Sam&Dean), and I can't see the Winchesters together in that way. I think I'm seeing the obvious caring and chemistry between J&J and can imagine them together, but it only translates into brotherly love on screen.

Did I explain it right? *shakes head* I'm not sure; but that's my honest opinion and my two cents. You may disagree, YMMV. :)

As for the wank itself -- I really don't know in what kind of LJ black-hole do I live but I always have to actively search my flist and flist's flist to find someone who linked to something that has the whole fandom in an uproar -- it's incredible! O.o And I kinda like it. ;)

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

i really do like the happy endings, yis.

and, yeah, it's not so much an uproar, i think. more of a blip. :D